±Forensic Focus Partners

Become an advertising partner

±Your Account


Username
Password

Forgotten password/username?

Site Members:

New Today: 0 Overall: 36620
New Yesterday: 3 Visitors: 104

±Follow Forensic Focus

Forensic Focus Facebook PageForensic Focus on TwitterForensic Focus LinkedIn GroupForensic Focus YouTube Channel

RSS feeds: News Forums Articles

±Latest Articles

±Latest Videos

±Latest Jobs

Startup Advice

Discussion of computer forensics employment and career issues.
Reply to topicReply to topic Printer Friendly Page
Forum FAQSearchView unanswered posts
Page Previous  1, 2, 3 
  

keydet89
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 21, 06 18:23

I personally don't talk about the rates, b/c I'm really not in any position to do so. I'm a worker bee, not a sales guy. Besides, if I quote a rate for one type of work, then folks tend to think that applies for everything...where it may not. My employer may charge a lower hourly rate, or go with a flat rate, or even opt for time and materials, depending upon the situation.

Another issue is that smaller companies are going to charge different rates. Let's say someone in a large firm gets charged out at $300/hr, b/c they're a senior analyst. A junior analyst may get charged out at $215/hr. These are rates at a large company...nation-wide, maybe even global. Smaller companies that are regional really need to be cognizant of what the local market supports...$300/hr for a senior analyst may be way out of range for some potential customers.  
 
  

dietro
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 21, 06 19:09

Maybe it is time that the professional organizations involved in this field join together for the sole purpose of conducting the first annual salary/billing rate survey. Not only could the salary and/or billing rates be surveyed, but other issues relating to private practice vs. med-large practice employment vs. corporate; and public vs. private sector; region vs. region; junior vs. mid-level vs. senior; etc etc.

Forget those entering the field for a minute, such information could be a huge benefit to those already involved in this field. You can determine where you place in the market and if you are ahead of, or behind the curve and whether you need to re-examine your current situation.

I say that the professional organizations in this industry need to be involved because they are the ones with the membership lists. Any single person can throw up a website and post the link on every list serv, mailing list and forum. But is there any real validity to the results that would be collected? Who knows! By having the organizations involved, you are soliciting results from people who have cared enough to pony up some cash and join a professional organization involved in this industry. The results collected from the memberships of such organizations may not be overly valid either, but I'd bet they'd be closer than a "click here" survey.

Just something to chew on....  
 
  

keydet89
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 21, 06 19:23

> ...such information could be a huge benefit to those already involved in this field

How so? Part of competitive advantage is "we have highly skilled/trained guys". How does one quantify that, particularly in a survey?

IMHO, this is one of those things that folks need to work out, from a sales/marketing perspective.

For folks opening up a small shop and hanging out a shingle in a particular region, you really need to develop a business plan, specifying the market (small- or medium-sized businesses, etc) that you're going to target. Then you have to look around and figure out who else is out there, and what you offer over them.

Every shop has to do this. GeekSquad had to do it...everyone. This isn't something you can build into EnCase, and just click on a button. Sometimes, guys, you gotta actually sit down and think about things...not everything has a technical solution.

Harlan  
 
  

dietro
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 21, 06 21:06

- keydet89
> ...such information could be a huge benefit to those already involved in this field

How so? Part of competitive advantage is "we have highly skilled/trained guys". How does one quantify that, particularly in a survey?


You can't completely quantify it in a survey and I never implied that you could.

However, you questioned how such information could be of benefit to those already in the field. Let me ask you this: Do you know how much your competition in your own market charges for their services? If you don't, then you have no real idea if are you over-charging or under-charging do you?

- keydet89
IMHO, this is one of those things that folks need to work out, from a sales/marketing perspective.

For folks opening up a small shop and hanging out a shingle in a particular region, you really need to develop a business plan, specifying the market (small- or medium-sized businesses, etc) that you're going to target. Then you have to look around and figure out who else is out there, and what you offer over them.


You could offer unique competencies or specialized services, or something else that distinguishes you in some fashion. However, one area of competition is pricing. If you have no idea what XYZ Forensic Examiners, Inc. who has been in business in your market for four years charges, then how do you propose to position yourself on pricing against them? A well participated in survey would provide some guidelines to help figure out where you place yourself.

Not only that, going back to your "How so?" question, if you are actually XYZ Forensic Examiners, Inc., how do you have any idea if what you've been charging for four years is over or under the general market average. Maybe you've been plugging along and barely getting by while overcharging and chasing away potential customers. A modest drop in your hourly charges (call it a "market correction" ;)) might actually result in an increase in your volume of work and in turn your overall revenues.

- keydet89
Every shop has to do this. GeekSquad had to do it...everyone. This isn't something you can build into EnCase, and just click on a button. Sometimes, guys, you gotta actually sit down and think about things...not everything has a technical solution.


Absolutely. However, when you sit down to think, don't you collect as much information about the topic as possible? If you had information that gave you an idea what the market is currently paying per hour for forensic examinations in your area, you mean to tell us that you wouldn't use that information while thinking things out?

All the results of a survey like I've suggested would be is a single tool. If someone is a point-n-click examiner who only uses one tool, then such results would be just as dangerous in their hands as their Encase dongle. Wink  
 
  

keydet89
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 21, 06 21:40

> However, one area of competition is pricing.

Exactly, so why would someone want to respond?

Let's say you put together a good survey...given that pricing is competitive, why would I bother to respond to the survey? No one is going to respond with their company name, b/c this is competitive information...and how useful is anonymous info going to be?

> ...you mean to tell us that you wouldn't use that information while thinking things out?

Wow, we got to the point where people start putting words in your mouth alot quicker than I expected! I never said that anywhere.

Thanks, but I'll bow out now...  
 
  

dietro
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 22, 06 00:02

- keydet89
> However, one area of competition is pricing.

Exactly, so why would someone want to respond?


Buried in your next comment is the answer....it is anonymous.

- keydet89
Let's say you put together a good survey...given that pricing is competitive, why would I bother to respond to the survey?


How is responding to an anonymous survey going to hurt you competitively? I must be missing something...

- keydet89
No one is going to respond with their company name, b/c this is competitive information...


Exactly. Who is suggesting anyone would be asked to provide that information?

- keydet89
and how useful is anonymous info going to be?


Why wouldn't it be useful? If there are ten companies providing services in your area, and seven of them respond anonymously, you'll have a pretty solid picture of what your market is like.

- keydet89
> ...you mean to tell us that you wouldn't use that information while thinking things out?

Wow, we got to the point where people start putting words in your mouth alot quicker than I expected! I never said that anywhere.

Thanks, but I'll bow out now...


Listen, I lurk here alot more than I post, and as such I have a great deal of respect for your technical knowledge, but the editing job you just did there to feign indignation is pretty amazing.

First, you need to re-read your own quote:

- keydet89
Sometimes, guys, you gotta actually sit down and think about things...not everything has a technical solution.


I then replied with this:

- dietro
Absolutely. However, when you sit down to think, don't you collect as much information about the topic as possible? If you had information that gave you an idea what the market is currently paying per hour for forensic examinations in your area, you mean to tell us that you wouldn't use that information while thinking things out?


Do you notice something? How about the question marks? No words were put into your mouth. Your comment, in fact your entire post, implied certain things. I asked for clarification. What I got was indignation and a "I'm taking my ball and going home."

Listen if you don't like the idea of a salary/billing survey fine. Your stated reasons for opposing it seem awfully flimsy, but what do I know. Listen if it ever comes to pass, it is OK, no one would force you to participate....  
 
  

OldDawg
Senior Member
 

Re: Startup Advice

Post Posted: Jul 25, 06 06:23

Google is your friend. Search for "computer forensic rates". A couple of the first handful of listings has rates for various CF services.  
 

Page 3 of 3
Page Previous  1, 2, 3