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Chip off or JTAG

Discussion of forensic issues related to all types of mobile phones and underlying technologies (GSM, GPRS, UMTS/3G, HSDPA, LTE, Bluetooth etc.)
Subforums: Mobile Telephone Case Law
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Chip off or JTAG, which would you choose?

7
30%

16
69%

 
Total Votes: 23

  

sideshow018
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 20, 14 02:28

www.ibreakityoufixit.c...ensics-kit

Kits can be bought through Teel Tech Canada or USA as well, make sure you specify your power specs, 110 or 220 before hand.  
 
  

jaclaz
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 20, 14 22:16

- sideshow018
http://www.ibreakityoufixit.com/shop/wp-forensics-kit

Kits can be bought through Teel Tech Canada or USA as well, make sure you specify your power specs, 110 or 220 before hand.

I see, thanks Smile .

I would have said "less than 700 US$" but didn't take into account some of the tools included into that kit:
  • Wild PCS stereo microscope
  • USB pen digital microscope
  • Ultrasonic cleaning machine
  • Pre heater station CO853
  • DC power supply 80
which should cost around US$ 500-600.

Which however are more "repair" than "pure chip-off", IMHO.

jaclaz
_________________
- In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is. - 
 
  

sideshow018
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 21, 14 00:11

The kit is for both JTAG and Chipoff. Chipoff, for obvious reasons, you will not be repairing phones, but for JTAG, you need a working phone to complete the process, thus the repair equipment. Students are taught repair in the Teel Tech JTAG class. No point trying to JTAG a phone if it does not work (-:  
 
  

jaclaz
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 21, 14 01:52

- sideshow018
The kit is for both JTAG and Chipoff. Chipoff, for obvious reasons, you will not be repairing phones, but for JTAG, you need a working phone to complete the process, thus the repair equipment. Students are taught repair in the Teel Tech JTAG class. No point trying to JTAG a phone if it does not work (-:

Sure Smile , but normally a seized phone is working and it is not like adding/soldering a few wires (if a clip/connector is not available) for JTAG is going to (or should normally) "break" the phone, I mean good to have those, in case of need, but possibly not "basic requirement", on a strict budget.

If you prefer, how often do you use the pre-heater or the (stereo) microscope?

Like, you know:
  • "on every device"
  • "on one out of 33" Shocked devices
  • "never used but once after JTAG class"
Wink

And besides the "same" Wild PCS course for "advanced" board repair is 3 days, if I get this right the TeelTech LEO courses somehow "compress" board repair into 1 or one and a half days.

jaclaz
_________________
- In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is. - 
 
  

sideshow018
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 21, 14 02:57

Hmmm, keep in mind, we do get broken phones from bad guys, they break them just before arrest, they throw them in water just before arrest, phone are subject to other cases like arsons where they are found damaged, etc. In same cases, the bad guy has an old broken phone in the residence and has moved on to a new phone, might have dated evidence on that. Normal wear and tear, USB port broken, screen broken, digitizer broken, etc. Not ever phone that Police seize is a fully functioning phone.

Having cell phone repair skills and tools is an asset for every mobile forensics lab.

Pre-heater - used on 90% of Chipoff phones
Microscope - used on 90% of Chipoff to examine pinouts and 90% of JTAG to examine your solder work.

The kit has been condensed to the most important and used items from all the tools that they/we sell.

The full cell phone repair course is 5 days, we condense the most important stuff for our purposes in 2 days for the JTAG class, you get less than a day for the Chipoff class.

If you want to learn the whole process and get certified, then you should take the 5 day Cell Phone Repair class.  
 
  

JaniN
Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 21, 14 14:29

- sideshow018
The kit is for both JTAG and Chipoff. Chipoff, for obvious reasons, you will not be repairing phones, but for JTAG, you need a working phone to complete the process, thus the repair equipment. Students are taught repair in the Teel Tech JTAG class. No point trying to JTAG a phone if it does not work (-:


JTAG should still work if for instance just the screen is broken. So even if the phone looks dead, it might be possible to JTAG.  
 
  

jaclaz
Senior Member
 

Re: Chip off or JTAG

Post Posted: Jan 21, 14 19:44

- sideshow018

The kit has been condensed to the most important and used items from all the tools that they/we sell.

Good. Smile
As a side note, the "they/we" might require a "full disclosure statement" on your part Question .

Mind you I am not saying that the kit is in any way "wrong" or "not nice" :), only that - without being LE, and without being certified in *anything* Shocked - I have done some repairs and "JTAG unbricking" of cell phones with much less (and much "worse") tools, and I have seen labs of people doing for a living cellphones repair without having a (stereo) microscope or a pre-heater.

I did declare before how I am cheap Wink and, as jhup recently posted:
www.forensicfocus.com/...5/#6570435
- jhup
Do not underestimate the Russians, Indians, Pakistanis and Chinese when it comes to hard core chip-off work. I watched third-world lab worker reball a micro-FCBGA with a $2 soldering iron, like as if he was just making a salami sandwich. The result was better looking than something off of a $10K reflow workstation!


Anyway, the "general" point is that give or take these US$ 500-600, we do agree that with around US$ 10,000 one can have the full equipment needed to do both Chipoff and JTAG, on a very vast array of devices, which is substantially different from the starting £200K stated in the OP, which was, is and remains "a crazy amount of money", not entirely unlike a number of cases where the Governement and/or the Military pay awful lots of money for something that can be replaced with something with the same or similar functionalities for much less, it comes to my mind the reknown "NASA pencils" which were paid a mere $128.89 apiece (in 1965) Wink :
www.scientificamerican...nasa-spen/
history.nasa.gov/print...cepen.html

jaclaz
_________________
- In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is. - 
 

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