hello, im new to here but i was hoping to get some advice from you guys out there in the real world. I have my degree in computing forensics and planning on working in this area. However I was wondering what role accountancy plays in the field of forensics? I was thinking of taking up studies to become more knowledgable in accountancy which i thought may help in areas of finantial fraud and so on. Is this a big area out there and is there a need for forensic accountants in CF?
thank you
Certainly it's a big area. Both law enforcement and the large accountancy firms concentrate heavily on fraud cases so any accounting knowledge will be a plus, although in my experience computer forensics experts usually work together with forensic accountants rather than the investigator possessing a combined skill set.
I tend to think attempting to specialise in both areas runs the risk of becoming a jack of all trades (and master of none) but others may disagree.
Jamie
I am not an accountant but it may not be a bad approach to learn some aspects of acountancy as you may find that useful. For instance, writing a forensic program that detects VAT carousel fraud or maybe help companies with stock theft……
Our practice is composed of computer forensics examiners and Certified Fraud Examiners (CFE) and Certified Public Accountants (CPA). While it is good to have some cross knowledge I cannot imagine knowing audit like the CPAs and vice versa.
thank you this is useful advice. Im wondering then, is there actually a good combination to have with CF. Apart from soley studying CF i want to widen my horizons and as you say it may mean a 'jack of all trades' but is there a good extra area to study to combined with my CF knowledge?
A well rounded education is certainly a bonus. I would probably have added additional criminal justice and accounting classes to my education if I had it to do again. As it is continuing professional education and various seminars have helped me round out my knowledge base.
I would concentrate on the computing side.
If you want to specialise, spend time learning the structure of typical files in the area you want to work in. For instance, how accountants store their finacial details. How e-mail systems work. How graphics formats work.
The ability to track down information that an investigator wants is far more valuable than knowing tax laws. (Others may think otherwise).
The ability to track down information that an investigator wants is far more valuable than knowing tax laws. (Others may think otherwise).
If this is the type of area you would like to specialise in then I think some general knowledge of accounting would help. It is not necessary to understand tax laws etc but do you know what a G/L is, double side entry in accounting etc? Alternatively do you know any of the software systems such as SAP and how the tables store financial data, how they are linked and whats the best way to query this data?
In my experience I have spent alot of time trying to understand these concepts and interrogating data to produce reports. It is important to understand how the reports were generated and what they show and as mscotgrove suggests, the ability to give the investigator what they need.
Ronan
Hi,
Just sharing my thoughts here (as someone who studied forensics and worked as IT auditor).
I was thinking of taking up studies to become more knowledgable in accountancy which i thought may help in areas of finantial fraud and so on.
Being able to understand the data in front of you is useful, but if you tend to 'study in depth' the topic you will become an accountant…
I would concentrate on the computing side.
On the other hand as mscotgrove says you have the option to concentrate/specilise more on a field within the general computing area (programming, networking, hardware, OS oriented).
So i guess it all comes down to the extend and the area of specialisation you wish to obtain and what drives your need for specialisation (market trends, personnal preferences or skills etc.).
Hope that helps… *_*
I was thinking of taking up studies to become more knowledgable in accountancy which i thought may help in areas of finantial fraud and so on.
Being able to understand the data in front of you is useful, but if you tend to 'study in depth' the topic you will become an accountant…
As someone working with accountants daily, I know I am not likely to become a CFE any time soon. When I started it would have been better to know more about accounting so that when the auditors were discussing how to track fraud (or whatever else) and tossing around a lot of jargon I could understand how to relate that to where to look for the data.
For example Understanding the Fraud Triangle can help you understand when and how the fraud began. Understanding Materiality will help you learn to dismiss irrelevant findings.
Another key area to learn is Excel. Now it may seem trivial, but if you work with accountants you will find yourself spending a lot of time writing scripts and formulas in Excel to find or compare data. Check out ActiveData for Excel and some of the similar fraud detection tools. Understanding how to get data out of the GL program and into Excel for analysis is an extremely helpful skill.
As alien wrote, "Being able to understand the data in front of you is useful, but if you tend to 'study in depth' the topic you will become an accountant…" so understand the concepts and ideas of accounting not necessarily the nuts and bolts.
A good primer for the subject is A Guide to Forensic Accounting Investigation by Golden, Skalak & Clayton. You can probably find a used copy for US $125.
