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Kkie21
(@kkie21)
New Member

Hello

I will soon be going into my final year at uni and I will doing a forensics project.

I was thinking about writing a program that would be put onto a USB stick and then once connected to a android device it will forensically image the it. Everything will be placed on the USB stick which will be write protected once the data is copied.

Is this a realistic idea or would am I going to be taking on too much?

Thanks

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Posted : 08/06/2015 12:39 am
TofuBoy
(@tofuboy)
New Member

A few things about your idea,

how would I know it has finished imaging/downloading data successfully?
how can I control what I want? I assume that if I don't have a choice then it just gets everything?
what benefits would this have over other methods? why would you use this method over a laptop and usb cable? or even portable solutions like the ufed touch?

whether this is a good or bad idea, have you thought about such questions?

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Posted : 08/06/2015 5:34 am
athulin
(@athulin)
Community Legend

Is this a realistic idea or would am I going to be taking on too much?

What amount of work is this project expected to tale? I assume you have a rough idea?

What kind of result should the project deliverables live up to? That is, I assume it's not just 'write a program', but also some kind of project documentation, and perhaps additional stuff. How much time will be needed for that?

What amount of work remains? Does the equation balance?

Do you have any project planning skills or experience, or are you likely to mis-estimate the work required?

If you cannot estimate the time required for your proposed project, you are very likely to be trying to bite off more than you can chew.

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Posted : 08/06/2015 1:15 pm
Kkie21
(@kkie21)
New Member

Thanks for the replies.

I was lucky enough to go to a forensics constabulary and was shown how mobile phones were handled when analyzing it. A very expensive box that was used to stop any signal to the phone. My thinking behind this project was a way around using live evidence.

There would be no way of knowing if it would be finished, giving enough time to be sure would be the only way around that. I was thinking that it would be quick and efficient due to it being as simple as inserting the USB into the device. I was also think about making an EnScript to allow it to be read by encase.

I feel I have good project management skills and could manage the project to fit the time scale that I have Which would be around 13 weeks. There would be a lot of research and paperwork to go with the project but I do feel I wold be able to handle the workload before the deadline. I do have good programming skills and experience with with Java, Python and C.

This is purely just an idea which I thought of and just started doing some research into so please forgive me if it all sounds a bit unrealistic.

Thanks

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Posted : 08/06/2015 3:03 pm
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

I have to ask how (or rather what) is booting the device in this scenario?
Or if you prefer how is the program on the USB started and in which environment will it run?

Is the USB thingy the boot media?
And how do you make the device boot from it?

Or it is the "normal" device OS (Android in this case) the booted OS?

If this is the case the program would be more than anything else a "dd-to-self-storage" kind of tool and it will need to have some particular capabilities to be allowed to run in the Android OS, unless i am missing something. ?

jaclaz

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Posted : 08/06/2015 3:35 pm
Chris_Ed
(@chris_ed)
Active Member

Some things occur to me while reading your description.

I was thinking about writing a program that would be put onto a USB stick and then once connected to a android device it will forensically image the it.

My assumption is that you are dicussing plugging the USB stick into the device directly? If so, there are two ways you can execute this

1 - get the device to run your code from the USB stick

2 - get the USB stick to connect and download data from the device

Option 1 is difficult to the point of impossible, as I understand it. iDevices are pretty much out the window immediately as they don't do added external storage AFAIK, and Android won't work without some serious shenanigans (like allowing apps to sideload).

Option 2 is interesting, I guess, but it requires the USB stick to have it's own OS and independent power source. But if your USB stick is a mini computer, then what is the advantage of using it over an actual computer? I mean, you gain huge advantages (a screen!) and lose the huge disadvantages (lack of a screen!).
The other thing to bear in mind with option 2 is that you are also going to have to write device drivers for a huge number of phones and models for it to be of any use.

Sorry, this all seems a bit Negative Nancy, and well done for thinking outside the box (heh), but I think this is not really something achievable for a Final Year Project.

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Posted : 08/06/2015 6:07 pm
Chris_Ed
(@chris_ed)
Active Member

.. but by all means prove me wrong and make billions of dollars. )

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Posted : 08/06/2015 6:07 pm
Kkie21
(@kkie21)
New Member

Thanks all for the replies

I purchased a cable with fitted into the charging port of my android device and a USB port on the other end. I inserted my USB and was able to view my university work and open files with applications. This is what lead me to believe that there wasn't a need for a power supply to the USB.

I had completely written of the idea of extracting data from any IOS device due to it being impossible.

The device would still be running the OS and the USB would have stored a program automatically run when inserted.
Permissions and privileges are also something I haven't taken into consideration.

After some more research iv come to the conclusion this would be way too much much work with the time constraints put in place and also maybe a bit of a pointless task with the reasons given in the posts.

Thanks again to all who replied.

Back to the drawing board I think )

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Posted : 15/06/2015 6:41 am
trewmte
(@trewmte)
Community Legend

Before you give up on your idea, are you are willing to compromise on your physical device?

ChipDrive from Towitoko has previously been used for mobile SIM Card reading. Maybe check with the company to see if they have a USB version. If so then this would be a GUI sufficient to display commands, icons and/or progress indicator. Also there are control keys around the edge that could be used for stop/start etc.

As mentioned above, this device has been used previously and programmed for reading and writing in fields other than time keeping and SIM card reading.

Have a look and see whether it meets your 13-weeks project management schedule.

http//www.chipdrive.de/index.php/en/smart-card-solutions/time-tracking-solutions/chipdrive-time-recording-kit.htm

New Blog Article
Android Copy and Paste - what risks? - http//trewmte.blogspot.co.uk/2015/06/android-copy-and-paste-what-risks.html

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Posted : 15/06/2015 12:04 pm
trewmte
(@trewmte)
Community Legend

If the original OP is still reading their own post here is an update

USB2USB File Management
http//trewmte.blogspot.co.uk/2015/07/usb2usb-file-management.html

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Posted : 05/07/2015 10:06 pm
BitHead
(@bithead)
Community Legend

Even if the OP is not, the rest of us are quite interested. Thank you for finding/researching/posting that info.

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Posted : 07/07/2015 8:15 am
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

@trewmte
I am not sure to get it (actually I am pretty sure I don't get it) 😯 .

That "yankodesign" thingy is NOT a product, it is a design concept, and a design aimed to be a "portable/incospicuous" device to

  1. see what files are on a (flash) mass storage device
  2. transfer files from a (flash) mass storage device to another
  3. [/listo]

    BUT the original (nice) idea by Kkie21 was about imaging an Android device, and unless I am mistaken the main issue here is that you do not have access from the USB port to the internal storage of the device (and the - optional - micro SD card can be of course removed and imaged with *any* reader).

    The "yankodesign" concept seems to me more similar to a "common" SIM or hard disk "duplicator" (with the addition of a slick design and the OLED display) a "cross breed" between this
    http//www.duplicator4u.com/u-reach-sd300-dup-white-1-2-standalone-sd-microsd-flash-memory-drive-card-duplicator-copier-and-eraser/
    and this
    http//www.startech.com/HDD/Duplicators/USB-1-to-2-Standalone-Flash-Drive-Duplicator-Eraser~USBDUP12
    with some added (nice) bells and whistles.

    I am failing to see the connection, what am I missing?

    jaclaz

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Posted : 07/07/2015 3:45 pm
trewmte
(@trewmte)
Community Legend

Bithead, thanks for your comments, appreciated.

Jaclaz… yes I think with respect you have missed the point. The earlier Towitoko device I mentioned identified that the manufacturer's original design (and confirmed) it had been altered to meet a new need. The design and "working prototype" of USB2USB as I understood it is not by Yankodesign but originated from "MIMOS Berhad". The purpose of mentioning the product was to extend to the OP (ideas/notions/inspiration) that a device can be altered to meet a need and here was a further example to consider.

I would be quite intrigued to see if an SD Card might hold a micro programme for imaging or the on-board chip could be (re-)programmed. And the hardware using USB at one end with another physical interface at the other might also be possible.

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Posted : 07/07/2015 11:58 pm
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

Jaclaz… yes I think with respect you have missed the point. The earlier Towitoko device I mentioned identified that the manufacturer's original design (and confirmed) it had been altered to meet a new need. The design and "working prototype" of USB2USB as I understood it is not by Yankodesign but originated from "MIMOS Berhad". The purpose of mentioning the product was to extend to the OP (ideas/notions/inspiration) that a device can be altered to meet a need and here was a further example to consider.

I still fail to understand.
From
http//www.yankodesign.com/2013/01/02/usb-2-usb-and-more…/

If only this wasn’t a concept and a reality, boy would our geeky lives become easier to share.

Chipdrive (the linked chipdrive.de) has developed a smart card reader with a LCD display that can read some contents of the smartcard and also write to it (with some firmware/software to do time/presence/accesses recording).

I am failing to see any evidence that the device preexisted as "Towitoko Chipdrive", I have seen "plain" smart card readers by Towitoko, called "Chipdrive" like
http//www.gemfor.com/en/product-towitoko_chipdrivemicro100.html
http//www.e-scan.com/smartcard/chipmicro120.htm
but they are seemingly completely different (and "dumber") devices.

There are a number of projects around Arduino
http//sourceforge.net/projects/arduinosclib/
Italian (but not that bad through google translate)
http//www.elettroinnova.it/

The Yankodesign (besides being seemingly not even a prototype, only an exercise in design) is simply a (nice looking) duplicator with a viewer, something that can be easily made with - say - a RaspberryPI
http//www.tweaking4all.com/hardware/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-openelec-using-a-hd44780-display/
http//richardhayler.blogspot.co.uk/2015/01/making-your-own-sd-card-clone-army.html
And if you want to overdo it, using a touchscreen
http//www.microcenter.com/product/442465/32_tft_lcd_module_320x240_touch_screen_display_for_raspberry_pi
and a web interface
http//www.rockandscissor.com/projects/osid/

I would be quite intrigued to see if an SD Card might hold a micro programme for imaging or the on-board chip could be (re-)programmed. And the hardware using USB at one end with another physical interface at the other might also be possible.

We do have some information on the chip (a 8051 compatible) inside some SD cards, see
http//www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=3554
http//www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?page_id=1022
http//bunniefoo.com/bunnie/sdcard-30c3-pub.pdf

And the Wi-Fi SD cards seem like a lot more promising )
http//haxit.blogspot.ch/2013/08/hacking-transcend-wifi-sd-cards.html
http//www.fernjager.net/post-8/sdcard

Though, if the idea is to have a display, most probably hacking a photoframe 😯 might be easier
http//spritesmods.com/?art=picframe
(good ol' 65c02 compatible inside) or maybe a MP4 viewer.

Hey, wait, maybe someone already thought of doing something *like* this wink (examples)
http//www.nextodi.co.uk/
https://www.digitalfoci.com/products/df-photo-solutions/photo-safe-ii.html
http//www.hypershop.com/HyperDrive/UDMA-2/
http//www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/jsp/Product.do?sku=B31B192002
though not really on the cheap.

jaclaz

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Posted : 08/07/2015 5:04 pm
trewmte
(@trewmte)
Community Legend

Jaclaz, you are merely identifying loads of breakout web-links which doesn't prove/disprove anything, merely you are reconfirming what you said at the outset that you don't personally understand. OK, this is fine.

It is the OP who is seeking ideas and doing the degree. I don't have to produce the tools or write the thesis for the OP and neither should you. And besides you're not producing the tool anyway…

The lead is there if the OP wishes to research thoroughly…will find the answers.

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Posted : 08/07/2015 7:16 pm
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