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qassam22222
(@qassam22222)
Active Member

hey all …
i need advice … there is a lot of product's in the market for PC forensic & data recovery …
i will buy PC-3000 and i need more hardware and software for Integrated laboratory !!
can u advice me what to buy for both hard and soft solutions )
thanks

Quote
Posted : 02/04/2018 11:14 am
Igor_Michailov
(@igor_michailov)
Senior Member

Do you have a lot of money? lol

You can buy
PC-3000 Express & Data Extractor Express
PC-3000 Express & Data Extractor RAID Edition
PC-3000 SSD
PC-3000 Flach
….

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 11:24 am
qassam22222
(@qassam22222)
Active Member

Do you have a lot of money? lol

You can buy
PC-3000 Express & Data Extractor Express
PC-3000 Express & Data Extractor RAID Edition
PC-3000 SSD
PC-3000 Flach
….

IS there any other product from other company ( hardware and software ) what is the best software for exctract data from windows and linux dd images ? I have money to buy 2 more hardware solution and 1 software

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 2:23 pm
c.wawrentowicz
(@c-wawrentowicz)
Junior Member

I use R-Studio

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 3:23 pm
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

I use DMDE.

jaclaz

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 4:41 pm
JaredDM
(@jareddm)
Active Member

PC-3000 is definitely the hardware/software solution you'll need for hardware level data recovery of failed hard drives. However, don't fool yourself into thinking that it's a push-button solution. Plan on at least a 5-10 year learning curve during which time most of your profit may be going to pay for remote support to a skilled professional. And, that's assuming you're a really smart guy or have some really smart guys working for you. Many people just wash out of this business in the first year of two when they realize how over their heads they are (and when they realize it's not all profit despite being a business where you can charge a fairly high price tag).

To even attempt getting started I estimate you'll need around $50,000 to invest upfront, and the first two or three years you'll need to dump most of the proceeds into further equipment/software to fill in the gaps in the types of recovery you have the equipment for. There is no way you'll turn a profit for at least that long.

Some bare minimum requirements to get started

PC-3000 UDMA (or Express if you want to be able to do more recoveries at once)
Data Extractor Software for PC-3000
HEPA or ULPA filtered clean hood meeting at least ISO 5 standard (these filters alone are around $400/ea not counting the $3-5K to buy the hood)
ESD mats, wrist straps, etc.
Read/write head separators, ramp sets, combs, etc. (plan on around $3-5K worth of these to start)
Tons of small tools (e.g. torx drivers, pentalobe drivers, etc. etc. etc.)
Workbenches
Testing equipment multimeters, etc.
Soldering / SMD Rework Equipment (& skills)
Flash Programming Equipment
Computers (high spec ones with tons and tons of RAM) - my current PC-3000 machine cost around $5K not counting the PC-3000 itself.
Access to hundreds if not thousands of hard drives and PCBs
Hundreds of different adapters, cables, connectors, power supplies, etc.
Mass amounts of temporary storage for hard drive clones/images (I've currently got 96Tb of DAS on my PC3K machine and it's still not enough some weeks)
Software, and lots of it.
You'll need some Windows machines, some Linux, and at least one bonafide Mac.

Some software titles you'll need
R-Studio Technician
Recovery Explorer Technician
Data Rescue 4 or 5
MacDrive Professional
WinHex or X-Ways Forensics
ReclaimePro
GetDataBack
CnWRecovery
and several hundred other programs and utilities that can do certain odd things you'll eventually need.

Then, if you want to actually get any clients, you'll need a powerful website with amazing SEO work done to it on a regular basis. This business has become crazy competitive online and to even compete in your local market will be tough when you see what you're facing for national competition for keywords. You'll need a strong advertising budget, possibly sales staff and support staff to allow the technician(s) undisturbed working time.

That's just to get started with HDD recovery. If you want to add Flash or SSD into the mix, you can start multiplying these costs.

I started my data recovery company in 2011 and I'd say I've easily invested $200K into it. That's not even counting the monthly overhead like rent, utilities, staff, etc.

But, today my business is turning a decent profit.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 4:57 pm
RolfGutmann
(@rolfgutmann)
Community Legend

Highly detailled post. Thank you Jared.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 02/04/2018 8:33 pm
qassam22222
(@qassam22222)
Active Member

PC-3000 is definitely the hardware/software solution you'll need for hardware level data recovery of failed hard drives. However, don't fool yourself into thinking that it's a push-button solution. Plan on at least a 5-10 year learning curve during which time most of your profit may be going to pay for remote support to a skilled professional. And, that's assuming you're a really smart guy or have some really smart guys working for you. Many people just wash out of this business in the first year of two when they realize how over their heads they are (and when they realize it's not all profit despite being a business where you can charge a fairly high price tag).

To even attempt getting started I estimate you'll need around $50,000 to invest upfront, and the first two or three years you'll need to dump most of the proceeds into further equipment/software to fill in the gaps in the types of recovery you have the equipment for. There is no way you'll turn a profit for at least that long.

Some bare minimum requirements to get started

PC-3000 UDMA (or Express if you want to be able to do more recoveries at once)
Data Extractor Software for PC-3000
HEPA or ULPA filtered clean hood meeting at least ISO 5 standard (these filters alone are around $400/ea not counting the $3-5K to buy the hood)
ESD mats, wrist straps, etc.
Read/write head separators, ramp sets, combs, etc. (plan on around $3-5K worth of these to start)
Tons of small tools (e.g. torx drivers, pentalobe drivers, etc. etc. etc.)
Workbenches
Testing equipment multimeters, etc.
Soldering / SMD Rework Equipment (& skills)
Flash Programming Equipment
Computers (high spec ones with tons and tons of RAM) - my current PC-3000 machine cost around $5K not counting the PC-3000 itself.
Access to hundreds if not thousands of hard drives and PCBs
Hundreds of different adapters, cables, connectors, power supplies, etc.
Mass amounts of temporary storage for hard drive clones/images (I've currently got 96Tb of DAS on my PC3K machine and it's still not enough some weeks)
Software, and lots of it.
You'll need some Windows machines, some Linux, and at least one bonafide Mac.

Some software titles you'll need
R-Studio Technician
Recovery Explorer Technician
Data Rescue 4 or 5
MacDrive Professional
WinHex or X-Ways Forensics
ReclaimePro
GetDataBack
CnWRecovery
and several hundred other programs and utilities that can do certain odd things you'll eventually need.

Then, if you want to actually get any clients, you'll need a powerful website with amazing SEO work done to it on a regular basis. This business has become crazy competitive online and to even compete in your local market will be tough when you see what you're facing for national competition for keywords. You'll need a strong advertising budget, possibly sales staff and support staff to allow the technician(s) undisturbed working time.

That's just to get started with HDD recovery. If you want to add Flash or SSD into the mix, you can start multiplying these costs.

I started my data recovery company in 2011 and I'd say I've easily invested $200K into it. That's not even counting the monthly overhead like rent, utilities, staff, etc.

But, today my business is turning a decent profit.

thank u very much JaredDM very important details <3

ReplyQuote
Posted : 03/04/2018 11:00 am
qassam22222
(@qassam22222)
Active Member

Read/write head separators, ramp sets, combs, etc. (plan on around $3-5K worth of these to start)

where i can buy this tools in complete package ( prof. tools )

Flash Programming Equipment

like what ?

ReplyQuote
Posted : 03/04/2018 11:29 am
JaredDM
(@jareddm)
Active Member

where i can buy this tools in complete package ( prof. tools )

If you want some high-end tools, you can look here www.hddsurgery.com (they are crazy expensive).

Though you can probably get by with some less expensive ones like these https://apextoollab.com/

Or just rig up your own tools for most drives like we do.

You'll often find that you end up needing multiple sets because one or the other set isn't good for certain cases or doesn't fit certain drives well. I've probably got sets from 4 different companies.

As to flash programming equipment, you'll need a way (sooner or later) to read/write ROM chips on really cooked PCBs, so you'll need something like this https://www.reveltronics.com/en/products/revelprog-is-serial-memory-programmer-usb

ReplyQuote
Posted : 03/04/2018 7:25 pm
JaredDM
(@jareddm)
Active Member

Here's another option for some heads tools http//www.drivestar.biz/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=66_104_214&products_id=5214

ReplyQuote
Posted : 03/04/2018 10:08 pm
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

Two notes, if I may

Plan on at least a 5-10 year learning curve during which time most of your profit may be going to pay for remote support to a skilled professional.
And, that's assuming you're a really smart guy or have some really smart guys working for you. Many people just wash out of this business in the first year of two when they realize how over their heads they are (and when they realize it's not all profit despite being a business where you can charge a fairly high price tag).

While I concur that it is a never ending learning story, maybe 5-10 years to get started is a tad bit on the pessimistic side, it's not - after all - rocket science or brain surgery and not even violin making.

Then, if you want to actually get any clients, you'll need a powerful website with amazing SEO work done to it on a regular basis. This business has become crazy competitive online and to even compete in your local market will be tough when you see what you're facing for national competition for keywords. You'll need a strong advertising budget, possibly sales staff and support staff to allow the technician(s) undisturbed working time.

A few humble requests for all people putting together a data/hard disk recovery service site
1) please DO NOT use "stock photos" on your site, make some real photos of your real work environment, and of real people actually doing actual work, instead.
2) if you do not have a "white chamber" (and I know you haven't one) do not publicize one, if you have only a laminar flow hood, state so.
3) if you (or your personnel) actually use white coats, surgical masks , and hairnets, photos of people in white coats, mask and hairnets are OK, otherwise get rid of them (they are stock photos anyway see #1)
4) data recovery is not (even if sometimes it is wink ) "witchcraft" nor "edge experimental medicine", do not make it look like it is.

Jared did something IMHO very good with this article ) (I would personally promote it from "old blog post" to one of the "main" pages of the site)

https://www.data-medics.com/data-recovery-blog/inside-of-a-data-recovery-laboratory/

(though he still has a few stock photos with white coats, masks and hairnets on his site, I presume they were *needed* to visually impact the new visitors )

jaclaz

ReplyQuote
Posted : 04/04/2018 11:11 am
JaredDM
(@jareddm)
Active Member

Jared did something IMHO very good with this article ) (I would personally promote it from "old blog post" to one of the "main" pages of the site)

https://www.data-medics.com/data-recovery-blog/inside-of-a-data-recovery-laboratory/

(though he still has a few stock photos with white coats, masks and hairnets on his site, I presume they were *needed* to visually impact the new visitors )

jaclaz

Yeah, I'm sure I've got some of those stock photos floating around on my site. The fact is, it's far too time-consuming to put together a lot of your own photographs, and they rarely come out looking as good as the stock ones anyway.

Stock photos are a necessity of real life when you've got a business to run. Some are pretty funny though I'll admit. I really get a laugh out of ones like this

https://www.data-medics.com/forum/download/file.php?id=910&mode=view

Why is he just sitting there staring into that open drive? Is that a Home Depot construction dust mask? Any why is he wearing safety glasses? Is the drive going to fire a projectile at him?haha.

We do actually use some such medical type equipment in our work. I personally run through a box of nice surgical gloves at least once a month. I never use hair nets or a "dust mask" but that's because our clean air benches have plexiglass shields in the front and only our hands ever really go inside the clean chamber. So even the lab coats are unnecessary, though I might have bought one for some old pictures.

I think the biggest reason we (data recovery pros) tend to use those pictures on our sites is to make clear that we do handle the clean room operations ourselves. Even if the pictures don't accurately convey what this looks like in real life. There's so many IT/computer repair shops out there advertising data recovery while just running some cheap software. So you've got to make clear on your site that you actually specialize in this and aren't just another virus removal shop.

Personally, I'd never do data recovery work in a walk-in clean room. It's completely unnecessary, and with a human body in there it can't meet the same ISO standards that our bench-top chambers do. Having talked with owners of other labs that do have walk-in clean rooms, they've admitted it was only a publicity stunt used to convince government bureaucrats why they're better than the competition. And they still use the bench top chambers inside the room anyway because they know that's what's actually needed to keep the air clean enough.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 09/04/2018 4:21 pm
JaredDM
(@jareddm)
Active Member

Two notes, if I may

Plan on at least a 5-10 year learning curve during which time most of your profit may be going to pay for remote support to a skilled professional.
And, that's assuming you're a really smart guy or have some really smart guys working for you. Many people just wash out of this business in the first year of two when they realize how over their heads they are (and when they realize it's not all profit despite being a business where you can charge a fairly high price tag).

While I concur that it is a never ending learning story, maybe 5-10 years to get started is a tad bit on the pessimistic side, it's not - after all - rocket science or brain surgery and not even violin making.

I've got to disagree here. I've been doing this professionally since 2011 and I still feel I'm nowhere near the level of understanding that some guys have (mostly Russians and eastern Europeans) that are genius level data recovery engineers. And that's despite the fact that I've performed well over a thousand hardware level recoveries myself. I'm not a dumb guy either. I was hacking AOL servers over telnet when I was in my early teens, so computers are very second nature to me.

You can learn the basics in a few years, but you'll still be constantly running into things you don't understand for years to come.

Keep in mind, data recovery is all reverse engineering. WD, Seagate, Toshiba, Samsung all have teams of hundreds of engineers constantly redesigning HDD functionality. Then, it's up to a few of us data recovery guys along with the help of engineers at Ace Laboratory to figure out what the hell they did and find a way to reverse engineer it to work when it's not supposed to. Compounding the challenge is the fact that some companies, namely Seagate, are actively working to make data recovery impossible for everyone except their own in-house lab.

Even after a life-long career in the business you'll still be constantly learning and researching new problems. I personally feel I've reached near mastery level with some brands of hard drive, such as WD. I've even recovered WD drives that the big name companies like Drive Savers couldn't recover. But, I know that with some other brands I've got a lot of learning to do still. Fortunately, there are other technicians I correspond with on a regular basis who are masters of those models and we help each other out as needed.

That's just discussing the hardware side of the business. Then there's the logical recovery aspect. It'd be great if the whole world was running a simple NTFS formatted single HDD, but that's not the world we live in. What happens when the drive is from a DVR with proprietary file system? What about when it's a RAID array that needs recovering? Or a SAN such as an EMC that's entirely proprietary? Or what happens when it's an encrypted mac partition and the partition table is lost preventing any software from being able to find it? Suddenly, you've got a new huge learning task in front of you if you don't want to outsource it all out and lose the profits.

Just this week, for the first time, I had to handle a Drobo case which had 28Tb of storage in BeyondRAID, a system in which each file effectively stored as it's own RAID array with blocks all over the place and had 4 failed drives. To boot, no commercial software was able to make heads or tails of the configuration. It took a straight week after recovering all the failed drives to make heads or tails of it (would have taken months if not for past experience) and we finally got it recovered. I will say, I now know a lot more about how Drobos work. Maybe I'll be able to use that knowledge again in the future, maybe not.

There's just so many different elements to it, and so little is actually documented or easy to find information on. That's why I'm telling you 5-10 years is not at all pessimistic. That's just to get to the point where you're able to handle the vast majority of cases on your own.

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Posted : 09/04/2018 4:41 pm
jaclaz
(@jaclaz)
Community Legend

@Jared DM
Yep ) , we are saying the same thing, it is not like when you started your business you were as knowledgeable as you are now (and you are still a bit "behind" some people in the field) but all these years you performed (successfully) those thousands hardware recoveries with only a partial subset of your current knowledge (and learning never ends).
I was only trying not to put too down or scare (too much) the OP, clearly one needs a passion and a dedication to the field, but one needs to start somewhere.

And about the pictures, yep, I know and you know (and most members here would know) but the message (to the general public) remains IMNSHO "deceiving", as "a picture is worth a thousand words".

As said you are one of the few in this business that made such a honest and clear post as the one I linked to, still the "stock" (please read as "fake") photos, *needed* as they might be represent without any doubt a mis-representaion of reality.

jaclaz

ReplyQuote
Posted : 09/04/2018 5:13 pm
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