No he's right. Being a member of HTCIA, I still disagree with their "defense" rule. (topic for another discussion however) Basically I'm saying, just get to know someone in your venue or jurisdiction just in case. Most folks will welcome you as a member of the same field anyway.
Two points jump out at me (1) If you are working a defense case you are verifying the data the prosecution claims they have. No civilian (in the US) is allowed to possess that data (again a side topic) so this brings me to (2) It then appears in a civil - trade secrets, divorce, HR - situation. By at least knowing on a professional level the person you need to go to can mitigate your exposure. Ok. You find CP, hashes match FTK's KFF (for example) - pics verify too. You have reason to be there…being paid by a customer, immediately tell the customer, and your local LE examiner buddy. I don't know anyone in LE that would charge for that. (that of course doesn't mean some moron wouldn't.)
I like using examples from non-digital forensic environments. If you're an air conditioning guy and you open a duct at a customer's house and find illegal drugs it depends what you do with it that matters. Call the cops or start a retirement fund?
Again it's the motives of the examiner.
As for being a mandated officer in my state. Again, a real life example - say I help my brother build decks on the weekends and I see a grow operation at a customer's house. (1) I am present under consent, they hired me to build a deck (2) My testimony is as a carpenter but (3) my credibility on the stand is of an officer and the "he saw, we all saw it" rule applies so whatever jurisdiction brings charges doesn't need to obtain probable cause - I just gave it to them.
Hope this clears it up. I do agree that this is a muddy issue, as with many of the standards in our field.
Actually as the law reads no one may possess CP. LE, citizens, etc. This has actually been argued that LE falls under the classification of a person.
There are many appeals going on right now to rule this unconstitutional, which most people who follow the topic say will happen.
Wasn't meant to be harsh at all. I was just stating my feeling that knowing an examiner doesn't do anything for a CP case. People can be still be charged with the possession regardless of examiners they know.
As it stands now most people are having to go to RCFL or a local office and the one person who loses out in this is the defendant. More and more people wont take these cases because they have to work in unfriendly, hostile, or otherwise unfamiliar surroundings.
Knowing examiners in your area has nothing at all to do with a CP case
I think that's a little harsh, the previous poster was simply stating that knowing people in the field is likely to help you stay up to date with current procedures and know who to call when you need to do so. Seems like a fair comment to me.
Jamie
armresl - What do you mean? LE aren't people? 😉
No seriously, very true. Aside from no one wanting to work a defense case on these I see LE making VERY bad mistakes. I would prefer not to mention specifics but there's a reason we have "Miranda". As for the state's attorneys I CAN mention their mistakes They, being an officer of the court are entitled to possess/view, the jury, judges etc (under guise of their position of course). I am not sure what you are quoting when you say "no one". How does the legislature expect the judicial system to work it the contraband can not be "possessed". My state's laws are pretty specific - as well as the Federal. Anyway, I HAVE seen state's attorneys turn my CD report over to defense - to walk away with. They just disseminated, right? What do I do? Put my Senior DA in jail?
I always allow "credible" defense experts in my lab - they can look at my images, use my tools, etc - I have just disseminated CP right? What was the context? Did he pay me money to see the images? Were we in some back alley? Was the purpose for sexual gratification? We are conducting legitimate business - one a government employee, the other paid by the defense. The totality of the circumstances. Other agencies in my state are following suit as well. It seems to be the best option out of a choice of poor ones. As for the "unfriendly, hostile, or otherwise unfamiliar surroundings"? My office is pretty nice. We have coffee, and a water cooler. It's air-conditioned. I don't even carry a gun or a badge. If any LEO has been unfriendly, or hostile I would like to hear about it… I don't deny that it would occur. I would like to know who to keep my cases away from. As for unfamiliar, I guess I can really address that.
I mean that the way the law reads is
Any person who—
The law does not include officers of the court (prosecution & defense while in court), officers of the law, judges, jurors, bailiffs, clerks, deputy clerks, as persons while conducting their lawful judicial business.
Any "possession" law in my state (and I assume most others in this country) do not exclude these judicial employees with every statute. Instead they are excluded in the Criminal Procedure Title of the Law.
Hi all,
When the matter comes up for the trial, It becomes the bounden duty of the prosecutor to establish their case with suitable evidence (including forensic evidence). The role of the defense is to disprove the case and the experts needs to scrutinize the evidence with the help of the forensic expert to know whether there was any foul play in the evidence and if so then what. It is also the duty of defense to put forth any probable alibi or negating circumstances and the role of the forensic expert becomes inevitable.
Kamal Dave
Advocate
India
I mean that the way the law reads is
Any person who—
Illinois CP laws have an exemption for law enforcement and court personnel
"(3) The charge of child pornography shall not apply to the performance of official duties by law enforcement or prosecuting officers or persons employed by law enforcement or prosecuting agencies, court personnel or attorneys, nor to bonafide treatment or professional education programs conducted by licensed physicians, psychologists or social workers." (720 ILCS 5.0/11-20.1(b)(3))
I think one could argue that a CF examiner is employed by the defense attorney and the charge is not applicable, at least in Illinois. As soon as you cross the border, the rules change. Indiana has no such provision, not even for cops. Although in Indiana, schools, museums, and libraries are exempt. Very weird. I agree, there has to be some consistency throughout the country on this and I hope it is resolved soon.
And Darren, you're welcome at the PD anytime. I'll even make fresh coffee!! D
And Darren, you're welcome at the PD anytime. I'll even make fresh coffee!! D
) Funny. Are you CPD, Cook or Lake, or a "village" around Chi town?
And Darren, you're welcome at the PD anytime. I'll even make fresh coffee!! D
) Funny. Are you CPD, Cook or Lake, or a "village" around Chi town?
"Village" - Tinley Park.