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(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Fresh news… from the front.
Two NGO [human rights groups from the defendant's country] phone us asking for details.
Share meeting with them and the people from the second lab will be organized after 26 December. We agree to form common task force.

I'm quite happy with all this. Sure, the truth must prevail- in reality, not only in the fairy tails.

In a mean time, we are totally disgusted by the judicial and parliamentary system in this Mediterranean country there, after they reject any form of cooperation with us, or unofficial hearings, unofficial exchange of information, or even listening to the arguments. Actually, they think that their neighboring country [the defendant's country] is some kind of "untermensch" subhuman race, which deserve always to be punished hard… awful even to write.

Our blacklist is growing everyday.

 
Posted : 22/12/2017 10:11 pm
(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Have some very interesting updates, and wish to share. Lets all colleagues here know, what kind of "forensics" exist in the aforementioned EU country, by what "proofs" they go to the court innocent peoples- let's everyone here judge by their own criteria.

Recently, we had the opportunity to read in full the official forensic report of the case. The phrase " we are dumbfounded by reading this piece of "forensic" " is at least, too little to be said. We are unable to believe, that this exist in one EU country with common regulations.

The curious facts, relating ONLY to the lab, and to the forensic part, are

* No paper "Chain of custody" exists - whatsoever, in any form, "species" or flavor. Nobody knows, who possess all these digital evidences, when, why, and so on. The endless efforts by the officials there to sell to us unrelated papers for "genuine" proof of "existence', only prove their, I must say directly- stupidity and arrogance.
* There is no any labeling and sealing of any digital evidences. NEVER- not at the scene, not after.
* The lab accept "bunch" of disks, put in one plastic supermarket bag. No check whatsoever.
* There is no an evidence file with matching hashes - the existence of "digital evidence file" is not mentioned anywhere in the official papers!
* After the examination, the lab send back all the evidences ( to whom?? … is not mentioned!!) with bunch of warm "wishes" to be preserved for future "investigations". All this- without any chain of custody, and not knowing, who takes the evidences back, where they goes, and when they will be stored.
* Actually, the lab do not possess ANY original data, or copies, on which they worked in the past. And all this, without existing ANY credible methodology of digital hashing whatsoever. Unheard of !! THIS IS THE NATIONAL forensic lab of one of the 27 EU countries!
* The lab forensics copies are, actually, invalid because of bad methodology, and the official forensic report is full with endless lies an innuendo about digital principles and methodology! Te lab use widely every kind and form of "declarations", without any logical or forensic explanation. They even call the digital evidences "tools". Sure, nobody will be able to take copies from all this, because they are invalid digital evidences, with no forensic soundness and credibility whatsoever.
* Nobody knows, when the lab take the evidences in their possession. There is no "chain of custody", or dates, when the evidences are accepted in the lab… in any form or flavor.
* Who inside the lab actually make the forensic work on this "evidences" is not known- the document is signed using cloudy terms.
* the seizure at the crime scene was make by unappropriated peoples, with no forensic educations or credentials whatsoever. The question is that they do not only confiscate … on the scene, they do FORENSIC work, with illegal tools, on original data, with no right to do this whatsoever. And at the end- no mention of all this "work" exist. Of any form. They simply lie to the investigators and the judges, what they actually do on the scene!

Who will recognize all this as "credible evidences" in one EU, or civilized, court?
We talk to some officials after Christmas, and asked them about ISO standards, ENISA, SWGDE, NIST, and so on, and so on- deaf ears, black India.

How sad I'm…why all of us do this work…

 
Posted : 28/01/2018 11:26 pm
MDCR
 MDCR
(@mdcr)
Posts: 376
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* No paper "Chain of custody" exists

That is mostly an American invention, never heard of it being in use. As long as the case is tracked and you can see who did what, that is sufficient. There is often talk of "Best effort" here, which do allow for some dynamics, but that does not mean that quality should be sacrificed.

* There is no any labeling and sealing of any digital evidences. NEVER- not at the scene, not after.

Bad. Should be able to track what item belongs to what case. Even though i never had "cases" myself we did keep track of digital media.

* The lab accept "bunch" of disks, put in one plastic supermarket bag. No check whatsoever.

As long as they know what case it belongs to. Is the serial number at least entered in some sort of cast tracking system?

* There is no an evidence file with matching hashes - the existence of "digital evidence file" is not mentioned anywhere in the official papers!

Would be a good idea to list it, but at times it can be sufficient to mention that "we found X on users hard drive that indicated that user did Y".

* Actually, the lab do not possess ANY original data, or copies, on which they worked in the past. And all this, without existing ANY credible methodology of digital hashing whatsoever. Unheard of !! THIS IS THE NATIONAL forensic lab of one of the 27 EU countries!

Maybe they simply don't have the capability, storage space or funding. Contrary to beliefs, government agencies does not swim in taxpayers money, especially in Europe.

* The lab forensics copies are, actually, invalid because of bad methodology, and the official forensic report is full with endless lies an innuendo about digital principles and methodology! Te lab use widely every kind and form of "declarations", without any logical or forensic explanation. They even call the digital evidences "tools". Sure, nobody will be able to take copies from all this, because they are invalid digital evidences, with no forensic soundness and credibility whatsoever.

Not really surprised. People without any knowledge working in the wrong place usually create this sort of "culture". What are their qualifications, did they watch an episode of CSI?

* the seizure at the crime scene was make by unappropriated peoples, with no forensic educations or credentials whatsoever. The question is that they do not only confiscate … on the scene, they do FORENSIC work, with illegal tools, on original data, with no right to do this whatsoever. And at the end- no mention of all this "work" exist. Of any form. They simply lie to the investigators and the judges, what they actually do on the scene!

Can be really bad, unless we're talking about necessary live forensics when you cannot take down a shared system. Anything done on a live system should be documented. They can have been instructed just enough to do that little job.

Illegal tools? Like pirated?

How sad I'm…why all of us do this work…

First, the situation is different for everyone. Secondly, butting heads against a corrupt government bureaucracy filled with career asshats in suits and uniform scratching each others backs only caring about paperwork that don't mean anything and their own status while the organisations investigation capabilities suffer and specialists leaving. That is a pointless and ungrateful task, believe me - I've tried. I'm going to the commercial sector, i'm gonna make more money and i've stopped caring as much.

So, consider finding a new job and leave them behind you, it's easier on your health. The more you spend time thinking of this will just make you depressed.

The alternative is to stop caring and sit on your b**t for the rest of your life until you qualify for a good retirement, there is lots of people in the government world doing that.

 
Posted : 29/01/2018 5:48 am
(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Thank you for your comments.
Actually, legally, the things are not so simple.

This is a national forensic lab of one of EU members country. They are officially certified on various standards- and this is officially written on paper, and signed by them. They must follow all the standards, they signed. Plus- the common, and mandatory, EU legislation. This is not a private lab.

One example- if they are obliged to recognize the investigative principles of the OLAF, they are not able to denied the validity of these principles in domestic cases, because this is a mandatory EU legislation. And it is not possible to accept this on EU level, and denied this on national level, because the EU legislation is mandatory.

Second example - if they want help from OLAF, they must present to the OLAF in existence mandatory evidence file of the case. Thus, they are not able to deny the need of this file presence, and in existence, in various local forensic cases, because it is a matter of common, mandatory legislation, on EU level.

Sure, Chain of custody exist in EU- it is labeled "Chain of evidence" here, and it is a mandatory document. If you have a gap of 3-4 months, unable to prove, where the confiscated was, and who in written was in charge, there is a big problem. Even in the aforementioned country, a special document exist!

ISO 9001 and the ENFSI clearly talk about the legality of the forensic tools ON THE SCENE. It is a mandatory obligation. And this must be written on paper after the finishing of the confiscation procedure.

 
Posted : 30/01/2018 11:38 pm
(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Recently, we learn, than major International convention after 13 years was ratified by the Greek government.
This make much, much more easy not only to defend the case, but also to prosecute the corrupted officials from the Greek cyber-crime unit and 2 of the official prosecutors, which falsified evidences and turn a blind eye to various invalid forensics practices, and obligatory for a validity of the evidences forensic rules and obligations.

Also, major progress was made on various forensic subjects.
I'm glad also to inform, that various human right organizations are continuously of immense help to us and to our efforts. More, we now have full support from our superiors and lawyers to continue.

 
Posted : 13/03/2018 11:44 am
RolfGutmann
(@rolfgutmann)
Posts: 1185
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Thank you for the update. All the best for you personally.

 
Posted : 13/03/2018 11:51 am
(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Topic starter
 

Thank you for the update. All the best for you personally.

Rolf,

Thank you. We learn, that someone send link to this topic to various Greek officials, including the Greek Prime-Minister and the Justice Dpt. Anyway, I'm glad.

Also we learn, that some Greek cyber-cops and some "curious" folks from the judiciary endlessly bites their fingernails reading and re-reading this topic.

Because of this, it is impossible for me to publicize the unbelievable things, which the two cops from the Greece cyber-crime unit and the Greek judiciary do. The specter's illegalities are from falsified evidences, tampering evidences to openly lie to the court. The judiciary not only turn a blind eye to all this- he helps the cops by "imaginative process of creation" of non-existing "facts", "twisting" non-existing "reality", and OFFICIALLY promote illegal evidences ( In Greece, there is no such things like - "motion to dismiss or suppress evidences" - all is admitted, if this suits someone's agenda ). The last is quite unbelievable, at least, so to speak.

Anyway, the fight continued… almost all my free time is dedicated to this.

 
Posted : 13/03/2018 12:02 pm
RolfGutmann
(@rolfgutmann)
Posts: 1185
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I stand with you and support your fight!

 
Posted : 13/03/2018 12:06 pm
MDCR
 MDCR
(@mdcr)
Posts: 376
Reputable Member
 

I stand with you and support your fight!

Same here, i wish you all the best. Stuff like this does not belong in a democracy.

Maybe you could pull in resources from Europol as well? Or at least consult them.

 
Posted : 14/03/2018 9:58 am
(@mickarneke)
Posts: 53
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Topic starter
 

After reading some "volumes" in our disposal

J= judge
D= Defense attorney
P = police two "boys".

D to the P " Please, show us that the computer of the defendant downloaded or shared prohibited material, by which software, when, to whom, and by what technical means you digitally confirm this".

P " Yes, yes, he do this".

D "Sorry, I asked you to present evidences, not your naked "opinion". Do you have evidences, digital data form surveillance, or any other kind of digital data in your disposal to support this grave accusation? Pls, if you do not have - tell us simply - "We have not" without any further words acrobatics".

P " We have not such digital evidences in our possession. No".

D "Why then you lie to the court in your affidavit- you are not able to present any digital evidences in support of your accusation".

P " We believe that he do this".

D " The prosecutor wrote - "The defendant visited various prohibited sites, and download material from there". Which sites are they, and when the defendant do this?".

P " We do not have such a data".

D " But the prosecutor wrote…"

J " Enough. Our prosecutor was right- the defendant do all this".

D" Judge… how this statement may be correct, when any evidences are either presented, either available, or exist to support this- i.e. which exactly "prohibited sites" the defendant visit, and when ??".

J "It is clear that the defendant do this! He visited all these sites- I judge this by my humble moral judgment and my legal right to have a personal opinion… Pls go further with other questions".

D " What kind of "personal opinions" may exist, when the evidences are missing??"

J " I'm sure, he do this. Our distinguished prosecutor and police forces do not lie to us. Never. Pls. go further with your next question".

D " Police officer, tell us what you do 4 hours "examination" the defendant's computer? Pls, show us log of your digital forensic activities on the spot". (from his live acquisition).

(There is an article in the Greek Civil procedure code that every document, written by public servant is CORRECT, whatsoever they wrote inside- even pure lies. Thus, it is prohibited in Greece to put in question such documents - the defendant only my try to prove that the document is forged. Thus, in 2018, whatsoever lies one Greek public servant wrote in one document, this is automatically accepted as "correct", and the public servant ( police officer, cyber-crime unit officer) is not obliged to prove the correctness of the facts and the data inside this document. Nice, isn't it? Atomic weaponry in small democracies… . Also, thus, every public servant there is able to "construct" whatsoever "evidences" he desire, and present this garbage like "a fact, an evidence, written in affidavit").

P Do not have a such log. I'm honest police officer."

J " What question is this, Mr attorney- they are humble police officers, very, very experienced on the filed. I rule that they do all properly. Pls- next question".

D" Present multiple evidences, that the now fired CHIEF of THE GREEK cyber-crime units openly lies to the police forces on various technical details, and committed various crime (according to the Greek penal code) in conjunction with the present case - i.e publicly on national TV labeled the defendant "pedophile" without any legal or medical ground to do this".

J" Irrelevant, irrelevant. The former police chief was humble public servant, not like this scumbag in front of me."

***
There is info, that the two members of the jury read irrelevant books, amusing themselves. An do not listen to the whole procedure.
After the end of the procedure, the 3 THREE judges GO IN TO THE SAME ROOM with the jury for the verdict. Nice, isn't it? Jury WITH 3 THREE judges! in the same room with the jury for small chit-chat talks- "decide", in common.

Is it a democracy there, or one Kangaroo court?

 
Posted : 26/03/2018 9:38 pm
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